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	<title>Comments on: One of Those Days When You Think About Quitting</title>
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	<description>Successes, failures, and a few funny stories about parenting.</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 06:05:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Amy</title>
		<link>http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-335</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Dec 2007 22:44:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-335</guid>
		<description>Jenny,

First of all, I'm the last person to say that I'm perfect here.  Far from it.  Most of the reason for the post that day was to share the difficulty I was having, to give myself a chance to analyze, regroup, and start over.  I'm not the only one out there who has rotten days, just one who's willing to put myself out there publicly. 

As for no one listening to the boys...well I gotta disagree with you there.  Had you spent the last 9 years looking over my shoulder you would have seen me trying everything I could think of to make learning appealing, interesting, and fun.  I love to learn new things.  It has been quite beyond me why they don't join me in the excitement.

I wish I could quantify clearly the difficulties that the older boys seem to have.  I was trained as a special educator, taught the EI (kids who misbehaved or had emotional problems) kids for years and loved loved loved it.  My master's is in educational psychology.  Yet I've never seen anything like the reaction the older boys have had to ANYthing remotely like learning. Even computer games-which they adore-that have anything like learning numbers or letters have been avoided.  TV shows, videos, songs, books, you name it they avoid it if they think it has to do with learning.  It truly seems to be some kind of language delay, coupled with motivation and self-esteem problems.  

Could I have contributed to this? Yep.  See above where I mention my  level of perfection.  Have I spent hours in prayer and anguish trying to figure out what I could change to make things better?  Yep.  I have.  I recognize that my behavior sets the standard for them, that if there's something wrong in my house that I have to look to myself first.

But where do you go once you've exhausted all the options? I've tried everything I can think of.  Heck, I'm still open to ideas and I try new things and make changes and efforts to make life fun and pleasant.  

There comes a point when the kids have to have some responsibility.  It's not wrong for me to expect them to contribute some effort to do their schoolwork.  In fact, I believe it's a major factor in the development of a quality adult to be practicing responsible behavior in youth.  I didn't bring them into the world to be parasites...and how fair or kind would it be to let them lead a completely irresponsible existence for 18 years, then throw them out into the world and expect them to succeed?  

As for interrupting them, I'm a little confused.  I didn't describe in the post an incident of interrupting a boy involved in a deeply meaningful activity to drag him off and torture him with school work.  Perhaps you'd like to elaborate on where that particular observation came from.  

Honestly, if my husband asked me to do something then I view it as my duty to do so, whether or not I like it.  And if he got frustrated with me for behaving badly...well that's okay.  I shouldn't be behaving badly.  If he got frustrated with me for just not liking it, then I'd have to say he wasn't a very understanding individual.  

Let me be clear: I'm not upset with the boys' feelings about school.  I am displeased when they behave badly.  Everyone has the right to whatever emotion comes their way.  They do not have the right to misbehave and/or cause pain or difficulty for others.  Setting a bad example and teaching little brothers to hate school is not cool and I'm not going to start that cycle again.

It's been almost 2 months since I made that post, and most days have been very good.  I've seen some really great things especially from the older boys of late.  They are now singing songs.  It's amazing.  They never used to want to listen to a song-any song-and now I hear them singing along to a few fun ones from movies and tapes that we have.  Also, they are showing some great imagination.  After seeing a show or hearing a story they frequently act it out, pretending to be one character or another.  Ooooh, and on top of that they're picking up books to read and enjoy!  Shoot, I'm telling you all this in the comments and not in regular post.  I'm saving the rest of my bragging for a post later tonight.  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jenny,</p>
<p>First of all, I&#8217;m the last person to say that I&#8217;m perfect here.  Far from it.  Most of the reason for the post that day was to share the difficulty I was having, to give myself a chance to analyze, regroup, and start over.  I&#8217;m not the only one out there who has rotten days, just one who&#8217;s willing to put myself out there publicly. </p>
<p>As for no one listening to the boys&#8230;well I gotta disagree with you there.  Had you spent the last 9 years looking over my shoulder you would have seen me trying everything I could think of to make learning appealing, interesting, and fun.  I love to learn new things.  It has been quite beyond me why they don&#8217;t join me in the excitement.</p>
<p>I wish I could quantify clearly the difficulties that the older boys seem to have.  I was trained as a special educator, taught the EI (kids who misbehaved or had emotional problems) kids for years and loved loved loved it.  My master&#8217;s is in educational psychology.  Yet I&#8217;ve never seen anything like the reaction the older boys have had to ANYthing remotely like learning. Even computer games-which they adore-that have anything like learning numbers or letters have been avoided.  TV shows, videos, songs, books, you name it they avoid it if they think it has to do with learning.  It truly seems to be some kind of language delay, coupled with motivation and self-esteem problems.  </p>
<p>Could I have contributed to this? Yep.  See above where I mention my  level of perfection.  Have I spent hours in prayer and anguish trying to figure out what I could change to make things better?  Yep.  I have.  I recognize that my behavior sets the standard for them, that if there&#8217;s something wrong in my house that I have to look to myself first.</p>
<p>But where do you go once you&#8217;ve exhausted all the options? I&#8217;ve tried everything I can think of.  Heck, I&#8217;m still open to ideas and I try new things and make changes and efforts to make life fun and pleasant.  </p>
<p>There comes a point when the kids have to have some responsibility.  It&#8217;s not wrong for me to expect them to contribute some effort to do their schoolwork.  In fact, I believe it&#8217;s a major factor in the development of a quality adult to be practicing responsible behavior in youth.  I didn&#8217;t bring them into the world to be parasites&#8230;and how fair or kind would it be to let them lead a completely irresponsible existence for 18 years, then throw them out into the world and expect them to succeed?  </p>
<p>As for interrupting them, I&#8217;m a little confused.  I didn&#8217;t describe in the post an incident of interrupting a boy involved in a deeply meaningful activity to drag him off and torture him with school work.  Perhaps you&#8217;d like to elaborate on where that particular observation came from.  </p>
<p>Honestly, if my husband asked me to do something then I view it as my duty to do so, whether or not I like it.  And if he got frustrated with me for behaving badly&#8230;well that&#8217;s okay.  I shouldn&#8217;t be behaving badly.  If he got frustrated with me for just not liking it, then I&#8217;d have to say he wasn&#8217;t a very understanding individual.  </p>
<p>Let me be clear: I&#8217;m not upset with the boys&#8217; feelings about school.  I am displeased when they behave badly.  Everyone has the right to whatever emotion comes their way.  They do not have the right to misbehave and/or cause pain or difficulty for others.  Setting a bad example and teaching little brothers to hate school is not cool and I&#8217;m not going to start that cycle again.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s been almost 2 months since I made that post, and most days have been very good.  I&#8217;ve seen some really great things especially from the older boys of late.  They are now singing songs.  It&#8217;s amazing.  They never used to want to listen to a song-any song-and now I hear them singing along to a few fun ones from movies and tapes that we have.  Also, they are showing some great imagination.  After seeing a show or hearing a story they frequently act it out, pretending to be one character or another.  Ooooh, and on top of that they&#8217;re picking up books to read and enjoy!  Shoot, I&#8217;m telling you all this in the comments and not in regular post.  I&#8217;m saving the rest of my bragging for a post later tonight.  <img src='http://www.earnestparenting.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Jenny</title>
		<link>http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-329</link>
		<dc:creator>Jenny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Dec 2007 16:52:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-329</guid>
		<description>I gotta say, I completely sympathize with your kids here. They're making it clear they DON'T like all this and are NOT enjoying it, and no one is listening to them! 

Blaming THEM because you didn't have time to do your other projects is crazy! Who initiates these school activites? YOU!! Did they WANT to do it, or ask for more? NO!!

How would you like it if you were engaged in something really important and interesting to you, and your husband said, "Stop what you're doing; you need to scrub the ceiling for several hours" and then got frustrated with you because you didn't enjoy it?

BTW, I am also a Christian whose kids are homeschooled.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I gotta say, I completely sympathize with your kids here. They&#8217;re making it clear they DON&#8217;T like all this and are NOT enjoying it, and no one is listening to them! </p>
<p>Blaming THEM because you didn&#8217;t have time to do your other projects is crazy! Who initiates these school activites? YOU!! Did they WANT to do it, or ask for more? NO!!</p>
<p>How would you like it if you were engaged in something really important and interesting to you, and your husband said, &#8220;Stop what you&#8217;re doing; you need to scrub the ceiling for several hours&#8221; and then got frustrated with you because you didn&#8217;t enjoy it?</p>
<p>BTW, I am also a Christian whose kids are homeschooled.</p>
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		<title>By: When Changes in Attitude are Necessary</title>
		<link>http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-184</link>
		<dc:creator>When Changes in Attitude are Necessary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Oct 2007 05:54:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-184</guid>
		<description>[...] If you were following the comments to my post about frustrating days last week, you&#8217;ll see some very wise words from Stu.  To get the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] If you were following the comments to my post about frustrating days last week, you&#8217;ll see some very wise words from Stu.  To get the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Amy</title>
		<link>http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-180</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 16:23:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-180</guid>
		<description>Ya, I definitely see the "my way" issue there.  I've thought of it more as a dominance thing.  Pack of 4 boys....natural to try and dominate each other and me.  The fact that they're both sets of twins lends confusion to the pecking order I think.  

The dominance issue is why I'm so fond of Cesar Milan.  I know he's into dog psychology and not kid, but much of it transfers.  Especially the part where the dog owner needs to understand how dogs think and relate, and then take the leadership role firmly.  With love, of course.  Sometimes I go wobbly on the leadership stuff, both because I get sick of asserting myself and I'm not as consistent as I should be.  It takes energy to make sure they're staying in the kid spot.  But they teach me and Hubby again and again who they need to be boss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ya, I definitely see the &#8220;my way&#8221; issue there.  I&#8217;ve thought of it more as a dominance thing.  Pack of 4 boys&#8230;.natural to try and dominate each other and me.  The fact that they&#8217;re both sets of twins lends confusion to the pecking order I think.  </p>
<p>The dominance issue is why I&#8217;m so fond of Cesar Milan.  I know he&#8217;s into dog psychology and not kid, but much of it transfers.  Especially the part where the dog owner needs to understand how dogs think and relate, and then take the leadership role firmly.  With love, of course.  Sometimes I go wobbly on the leadership stuff, both because I get sick of asserting myself and I&#8217;m not as consistent as I should be.  It takes energy to make sure they&#8217;re staying in the kid spot.  But they teach me and Hubby again and again who they need to be boss.</p>
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		<title>By: Stu Mark</title>
		<link>http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-179</link>
		<dc:creator>Stu Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 15:53:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.earnestparenting.com/2007/10/08/one-of-those-days-when-you-think-about-quitting/#comment-179</guid>
		<description>This word search issue, let's focus on that for a second. My money says that this is a "Mom, I want to do it *my* way" issue. If so, I empathize. My youngest essentially thinks I'm an idiot and has real trouble surrendering her control to me. One strategy I've employed is to demonstrate my acumen when she's up for it. That includes easy things, like watching Jeapardy together and me shouting out the answers as fast as I can. That usually impresses her. One time, when she was treating me like I was dumb, I just called her on it, saying "Hey, you wanna take matching IQ tests and see who does better?"

If it's not the "You're dumb" issue, it might be a control issue. When I battle my daughter on that front, I specifically put her in situations where she has no control. She gets uncomfortable, but it does seem to be working a bit.

My sister taught me this: "Remember, you are the parent and they are the children. Even if they try really hard to change those roles, don't let them."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This word search issue, let&#8217;s focus on that for a second. My money says that this is a &#8220;Mom, I want to do it *my* way&#8221; issue. If so, I empathize. My youngest essentially thinks I&#8217;m an idiot and has real trouble surrendering her control to me. One strategy I&#8217;ve employed is to demonstrate my acumen when she&#8217;s up for it. That includes easy things, like watching Jeapardy together and me shouting out the answers as fast as I can. That usually impresses her. One time, when she was treating me like I was dumb, I just called her on it, saying &#8220;Hey, you wanna take matching IQ tests and see who does better?&#8221;</p>
<p>If it&#8217;s not the &#8220;You&#8217;re dumb&#8221; issue, it might be a control issue. When I battle my daughter on that front, I specifically put her in situations where she has no control. She gets uncomfortable, but it does seem to be working a bit.</p>
<p>My sister taught me this: &#8220;Remember, you are the parent and they are the children. Even if they try really hard to change those roles, don&#8217;t let them.&#8221;</p>
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